Who Are You Without the Performance?

What happens when the identity you’ve built no longer feels like you?

In this episode, Sirel sits down with David Klick for a conversation that challenges some of the most common narratives surrounding men, women, emotions, strength, and success.

We live in a world that constantly tells us who we should be.

•  Be stronger.
•  Be more successful.
•  Be more emotional.
•  Be less emotional.
•  Be desirable.
•  Be respected.
•  Be accepted.

But underneath all of these expectations is a deeper question: Who are you without the performance?

Together, Sirel and David explore the social pressures that shape identity, the attachment to outside validation, and what happens when we build our lives around perception instead of relationship to self.

This conversation invites listeners to look beyond labels and explore the deeper layers beneath them.

• What does narcissism actually mean?
• What are emotions?
• What is strength?
• What is weakness?

And how often are we defining ourselves through the lens of society rather than through our own lived experience?

As the conversation unfolds, one truth becomes clear:

The relationship we have with ourselves determines our ability to navigate success, failure, relationships, criticism, judgment, and the expectations of others. Because the strongest foundation is not built on performance. It is built on self awareness.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:23

Oh, recording is actually in a higher quality than it looks like. That's good. Cause I was worried that that uh that my quality may not be up to snuff.

SPEAKER_03 0:34

Okay, boom.

SPEAKER_04 0:35

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 0:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 0:37

Boom. Glad to be here. Sorelle, thanks for having me. What are we uh what are we going to be talking about today?

SPEAKER_03 0:44

But I think what I really want to do is dismantle the illusion that men are narcissists and women are emotional.

SPEAKER_04 0:53

Ooh. Let's do it.

SPEAKER_03 0:56

Because that's a huge I see it everywhere.

SPEAKER_04 0:59

What you've heard is that men are narcissistic is is the overarching trend or the overarching thesis that is coming out.

SPEAKER_03 1:10

That's that's the broken the broken wound, I feel like, that women have hung on to. And a lot of them not may have not necessarily experienced that, but because that is the lines that they're fed, they immediately respond in that way.

SPEAKER_04 1:26

Yeah. Yeah. What's uh what's your reply when you hear that? What what happens in your in your world when when that equation comes up?

SPEAKER_03 1:35

Yeah, I think it's interesting because for me, I kind of reflect it back to them. You are going to attract, whether it be the broken parts of you, you know, or the parts of you that you're seeking outside of yourself, you're gonna attract that in another person. And so when when you fall in those patterns, right, of you know, relationships, of being with someone who doesn't complete you or is narcissistic. And what is even that definition, right? But or maybe even abusive, I don't know. But there isn't just one victim, it's you guys are recycling each other's energy.

SPEAKER_04 2:20

Well, I think it's uh the concept, the laws of attraction, right, that's been around for for a long time, where we attract what we are. And I I think that's true to an extent. And so it I just would comment on that first, would be uh we we do attract what we are, but I think we hold what we actually are. So we can attract what we desire sometimes, but then it comes in and we just can't hold it. Uh we don't have the capacity or we don't have the we're not at the stage to hold what we truly want because we haven't done it ourselves inside, which is what you're saying, is that it's not getting reflected back out there. So if I'll just say this from the beginning, anybody, man or woman that is in a physically abusive situation needs to leave. And I know it's easy to say that, but they that there's people that can help. And I talk to a lot of a lot of females actually that say, well, we can't leave. It's you don't understand. But sometimes finding that one person, finding that safe person to have the conversation with, right? That that's never okay to stay in in a physically dangerous situation. I think I'm imagining where we're gonna go with this conversation is more on the emotional side of things. So when when and that still feels dangerous to us emotionally, right? Energetically in the body, but I I'm guessing that's where we want to have most of our conversation is on the on the emotional energetic safety.

SPEAKER_03 3:47

Emotional energetic safety, because I think at the end of the day, it still comes back to relationship with self. And I think it's easy to point fingers when a relationship isn't working. But I do feel that that's a great time for you to still reflect within and master your relationship with yourself. Because if you can't hold that relationship with someone, it's because you couldn't hold it with yourself? It's because you could well, I mean, and it it depends. Sometimes, sometimes holding it with yourself though is walking away.

SPEAKER_04 4:21

Sure, sure, of course. Well, or you could have been misaligned, or you could have you could have been at a certain stage. I know in my past that that was applicable where I I was with someone that at that time when the relationship started, it it was a match, but but I continue to grow. And I think any it could be either either partner could continue to grow, and at some point, if the other partner's not willing to grow with you, uh then it's not a it's not a conducive, safe place to be.

SPEAKER_03 4:48

So um and I love that too, because I think relationship is set on well, we have kids together, right? Or we're I don't want to have a divorce, or I don't know, you're supposed to, I guess, only have one marriage, or so you're you fear the outside judgment.

SPEAKER_04 5:08

I believe how about you talk about that? So cultural pressures, like that is so prevalent with men. You would be I I would believe, I bel assume that a lot of females have uh the similar pressure, but but you know, I was just with 30 guys in a in a forest for four days, and and the pressure that society puts on men to be a certain way is so strong, at least in our Western culture, right? That's that it's prevalent. And let's talk about that. Talk about cultural pressures trying to dictate whether that's your upbringing and religion, you know, societal norms, uh, politically, you're going all of these pressures that get put on both sexes. Whew, uh gosh, I don't know, I don't know how we're even standing upright some of the times from the pressure that flows.

SPEAKER_03 5:58

I feel that. So, like, what were some pressures that men were feeling they needed to like the expectation, right?

SPEAKER_04 6:08

A lot of it was was the voice that came out, which is which is activating now when I when I'm remembering it. But but I think if you could distill it down uh it's that is that their authentic self wasn't or didn't didn't feel like it was welcome. Religion seems to put a lot of that pressure on, hey, this is this is this is who and what is acceptable and what what a family looks like and what a religious man looks like in in the 21st century. You know, money, you know, my they they talk about, you know, oh if if a guy doesn't have six figures that he makes every year, six packs, abs, and you know, at least six inches that he's packing in a sports car, right? He's not he's not good enough. And you're going, that that is pressure from the the the materialistic side, and you're going, ah, gosh. So yeah, there there's I think there is. I think and men have historically, at least in my experience, not had a safe place to really talk about that and what they feel. And so I'd I would say, because I think you started this saying, you know, men come across as narcissistic and females come across as uh emotional. I've had this conversation extensively and be curious on your thoughts, but I I don't believe, I actually probably very firmly believe that men have the capacity for more emotion than than females, but we've just we've just been suppressed with it.

SPEAKER_03 7:33

Yeah. There you just hit the nail on the head with that one, that's for sure. It's it's beautiful to watch a man emerge with his emotions because what I've noticed when I feel a man emotionally empowered, that is strength. Yeah, it's just so beautiful to think about because what is emotion and what is strength? And why has emotion been taglined as weak? Because emotion is just energy in motion. And so if you have a significant other, whether it be a man or a woman, and they don't have a safe place to move that that energy line, to feel it, to process it, to you know, recycle it, that's that's actually weakness. And that's I feel that's what creates the danger zone. So having a man that is emotion, that does have emotion, he can carry his energy. Yeah, he can move it, he can process it, he can be with it. And I think that's the most important part is being with it.

SPEAKER_04 8:51

Yeah. It's that's a this is a deep, a deep rabbit hole that I've spent years going down, first and foremost for myself and then also for other men. And I I've the vernacular that I've ended up using is is creating kind of five stages, if you will. And and there's what I would call inside of each of us, we have our ability to, if we want to call it emotion, and and I don't know what the another word for narcissistic would be for the man that's uh but to the mind, right? So if you have if you have your masculine and your feminine, is a way I distill it down to just for ease of understanding, or the head and the in the heart, right? That's a that's a a common way to talk about it, is is a lot of the head space is our our our drive and our intuition and or our drive and our uh vision and purpose. And a lot of the heart space is our emotional capacity, our heart, our our flow, things like that. And so I I have the belief 100% that uh we have full capacity as as humans for both of them. And so what I've kind of broken it down into is really so you talk about why haven't people felt safe to share that emotion? Because obviously women aren't feeling safe if they're being labeled by wounded masculine energy, that that's not good to be emotional. And so I so that the this the best picture that I could come up with was sort of like a spectrum. And you've got on the on the on the right, you've got like the wounded masculine, which doesn't understand his masculine or his feminine energy inside of him. And so he just he can't hold any space, right? He's just he's what society calls toxic. And then if he makes one step further where he's a like an emergent masculine, he understands his masculine energy and he knows how to be grounded, but he probably doesn't really understand his feminine energy so well, and so it's not a full balance. And then there's like the center where we we understand both in in in how to how each one of them flows and ebbs within our body. And then on the other side, you've got the the wounded feminine, which doesn't understand her masculine or feminine energy, and then her emergent feminine, which understands her feminine but doesn't understand her masculine, and then the center. And so the goal is if we can get to the center, so if you have a a man that is an emergent man, an emergent masculine, he's not gonna understand feminine energy, and it's gonna it's gonna feel threatening to him. And so while he may understand stoicism and how not to react and do this, but if he doesn't actually understand flow, he he's missing, if you can kind of imagine it as like a Venn diagram where they're overlapping, he's like there there's no flow with the feminine to feel safe. And on the same hand, if you've got a female that understands her flow but doesn't understand her masculine energy of how to hold space, the man is not going to feel safe revealing his feminine because her masculine is not gonna be able to hold it. And there's that's where fights and reactions and problems occur when a guy starts to show emotion and an emergent feminine is like, oh, that's threatening to my feminine energy. So I must react as opposed to holding that space for his energy. And so it creates this crazy vortex where we're not at our center, right? What's the eye of the storm in the hurricane? It's it's calm, it's peace. There's no craziness going around because when we're at our center, we can understand both sides and say, oh, that's a situation that's being called for. I need more heart energy or I need more head energy. So yeah, that that's kind of the best way that I've figured out how to how to have this conversation. And so I don't know if that makes any sense, but that that's how my brain processes it. Um yeah, what curious, what what how does that land in your world?

SPEAKER_03 12:26

I I receive that 100%. I think it's beautiful because it's not one side or another. So we talk about the mind and the heart. Well, we all have a mind and heart. And so this is still coming back to relationship to self. What is your relationship with your mind? What is your relationship with your heart? Like, do you know what it feels like when you are in those places? And do you know when your masculine is leading or when your feminine is leading? And I think I think those are great questions because that isn't something that is innately taught in in humans, learning how to be human. And that's why we have this problem in the first place.

SPEAKER_04 13:15

Yeah. So to go back to your original comment about men are labeled narcissistic and women are labeled emotional, I would go back to well, who's labeling them? Because to a even an emergent masculine man, if the female is so emotional and he doesn't know how to he doesn't know how to hold that feminine energy properly, he's gonna label it improperly. And the same to a female, if she's if she's in the wounded or emergent state and not a center state, she's going to view any masculine energy as as narcissistic uh and controlling and dominating and and manipulative. So that's why I would always just kind of go back to exactly the same. I think we're looking at the same picture. It all points back to the individual. And how do we train that? How do we go from awareness to the next step, which is which is how do we help change that paradigm, that that that misbelief that's out there?

SPEAKER_03 14:07

Yeah. Changing the lens when I think I think you're absolutely right about that, is who's labeling it because it's been labeled very wrong, I do feel like. And I think it we've adapted, and I say not myself, but I've I have been in a situation where I've been able to point a finger outside of myself and put a label on somebody. And that's still perspective. So it does it's not necessarily truth. So with that, I think that that is that is very intriguing because it's I think it still falls in the category of victim. Somewhere, somewhere along the way, there needed to be one person that was wrong, one person to blame. But in any relationship, it takes it takes two. So yeah, I don't I don't even know where that label started in the first place. But I do believe that it started with someone wanting to put blame outside of themselves.

SPEAKER_04 15:17

Well, it's so much easier if I can blame you, Sorel, for my problems than having to look in the mirror and say, you know what? Maybe I could have processed that differently. Maybe I could have handled that differently. Or where I've ended up falling lately is that there's two truths are possible at the same time. Your truth and my truth can can coexist. And it doesn't just because I accept your truth doesn't mean that I have to be wrong. And that's that's growth in my world where I'm like, yeah, yeah, your truth is here and my truth is here. And just because they're not the same doesn't mean that one of us has to be has to be wrong. What I hear you saying as well is that victim or owner, and so that's kind of how I I don't remember who many, many years ago, Tony Robbins or somebody came up with this years and years ago. But it's you either choose to be a victim or you choose to be an owner. Those are the that's the starting point. When you get out of bed in the morning, it's like, am I gonna be an owner or am I gonna be a victim? And everything is gonna shift from there. But yeah, if you're in victim mentality where, oh, poor pity me, guess what? That's gonna just circle around you and pull you down crazy. But if we're in ownership, it's like, okay, yeah, that happened. How am I gonna learn from it?

SPEAKER_03 16:34

Yeah, that's the best part. That's part of life.

SPEAKER_04 16:37

Yeah, can I tell a story about that that happened to me two years ago that that has really sunk in on that topic?

SPEAKER_03 16:42

Yes.

SPEAKER_04 16:43

So I was I was getting ready to host an event, and it was a it was a it was a pretty good size event that was gonna be held, and and I was leaving my house, and I forgot to get something at the store, and I was backing out, and I have on my my phone like a way to close my door, my garage doors up and down. And it will it wouldn't close. And I was like, I don't know what the deal is. And and instead of just waiting and taking a deep breath and closing the door, it would have taken me about 15, 20 seconds, it would have reset, door would have closed, I could have driven off, right? I was like, you know what, just screw it, I'm leaving, I gotta go to the store, and I and I peel out of the driveway and not not literally, but zooming down the road. And as soon as I get on the main drag, I pull out and a cop pulls up behind me and pulls me over, and I get a ticket for my car. And I was like, you've got to be kidding me. And and and I realized if I had just waited 15 seconds, the door would have closed, the cop would have been in front of me, everything would have been fine. And again, it it wasn't a big deal. It was it was but I realized at that point the universe is conspiring in my favor. If I would just be an owner and be like, you know what, I don't need to rush, I can just take this. And so that that uh that that little story has has stuck with me uh for a lot because I'm like, it's okay. So just because I think my kid's late getting her shoes on in the morning, or she forgot her books and I gotta turn around, or I for left my coffee on the counter, it's like, you know what? It's all part of the universe conspiring for us to be in the best possible place that we can be at the right time. And so at the right time, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 18:10

And I I love that because I call that being in relationship with the energy the energy of your life. And so I think we do live in a fast-paced world, right? And so it's like the hustle cult culture and the go, go, go. So when when you don't have that time to pause and reflect and just be, you're missing so much of the present moment. And redirections are everything. They they are just as much of a gift than you know, the the gifts that you receive, you know, on at your front doorstep, where you're like, whoa, thank you.

SPEAKER_04 18:48

What do you receive? Are you talking about Amazon that drops off the gifts?

SPEAKER_03 18:51

The Amazon gift from the Amazon driver.

SPEAKER_04 18:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 18:55

From the from the drone.

SPEAKER_04 18:56

Yeah, oh yeah, no kidding. Yeah. Hi.

SPEAKER_03 19:00

Well, so welcome, David. Thank you so much for coming on It's a Surah Life and bringing your gift and your energy and your perspective and your wisdom. I think that's the most the most beautiful thing that I um have been able to witness in you. You know, we met last year back in August, September. Yeah. And from then, you know, it I know we we created somewhat of a co-creation, but it's evolved more into a friendship. And so you are someone that I do feel safe with to be vulnerable, to be me, to have deep conversation with. And so I'm just so grateful that I know you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 19:50

Thank you, Sorelle. No, it's been awesome. I uh I was thinking about that today, and I think it's August. What is that, nine months? We've we've known each other and a lot of depth. We've had we've had hours and hours of conversations as we've sometimes gone down the craziest paths of I think we're talking about this for helping people, but now we're talking about society and the world. And yeah, it's it's been great. So it goes, goes deep. Yeah, glad to be here and looking forward to this conversation. I I didn't prepare for anything. I I just said, you know, I'm just gonna show up and I'm gonna be in my flow and let Sorelle lead this wherever she wants, and it'll be great.

SPEAKER_03 20:28

Yeah, that's that's the best way. So, do you want to just give a short introduction of who you are and where you're at in the present moment of your life?

SPEAKER_04 20:37

So, right now I'm in my office, Overland Park, Kansas. So I'm David Click. I where am I at? Who am I? I am a a lot of different titles, but the the things that get me the most excited in life right now, and part of my vision and purpose is helping other leaders step into their true power, step into flipping on the light switch inside of them and getting them aligned with where they're supposed to be and who they are. And and that that is dominating 110% of my brain capacity right now of how do I continue to evolve and help help fellow leaders in in Kansas City, in America, and across the world step into who they're supposed to be and why they're here this round and what they and their purpose is. And so the I'm sure we'll touch on a lot of it, but that that my my pedigrees range from energy work to all kinds of stuff. Wim Hof instructor, businessman, sales and marketing, author, written three books, and yeah, but I would say who I am is well, I'm just David, but I'm I'm I'm here to yeah, I'm here to help continue to light the network of souls across the earth as they step into their and step into their true purpose. And yeah. How's that?

SPEAKER_03 22:06

Yeah, that's so good.

SPEAKER_04 22:08

That's me.

SPEAKER_03 22:09

That is you. I can feel that.

SPEAKER_04 22:12

I will say it was really I I was always I think for the last 20 years I've been that younger guy that goes to an event, if there's 30 guys in the woods, I'm the one kind of absorbing and learning and all this stuff, and and a couple weeks ago I Helps facilitate a four-day event. And I'm looking around and I'm going, I'm kind of the old guy here. You know, these guys are they're getting sun and taking their shirts off. And I'm like, huh, yeah, I'm I don't look like that anymore. And I'm like, that's okay. And I really, but but the the message that I got, the energy that I got back from from every single man was the respect of of of my elderness, essentially. And I'm going, that felt really nice. That was that's it's it's different, but it felt really good to be able to give, give, give, give to every single individual, find out exactly where they are, see their path, see what's going on, see what's holding them back potentially and and helping them break through, and then to be honored as sort of the the old wise guy. And I'm like, cool.

SPEAKER_03 23:20

Yeah, well, you've worked hard to get here. That's a that's a lot of a lot of work. I mean, wisdom is you know, that's what we're all striving for.

SPEAKER_04 23:31

Something. I used to dye my beard when I hit my my 30s, and and so I'm 45, right? And so I I I would dye it even up to about five years ago. And then I realized, you know, the gray kind of makes me look older and more wise. Because even if I'm not wise, at least the gray like like shows up that way. So I stopped I stopped dying it.

SPEAKER_03 23:52

Yeah, good. I I like I like the gray.

SPEAKER_04 23:54

I'm in the I'm totally in there.

SPEAKER_03 23:58

Oh yeah. Oh yeah, it's so good. I cannot wait for like for it to really shine through.

unknown 24:04

Oh, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 24:13

That is so good though. Relationship, like even even in age, right? So like what's what's our relationship with aging? Is it just that we're reaching the end of time or you know, our our time, our clock is ticking? I mean, I don't know. That used to be mine at some point. I remember, but now it's just like it is such a beautiful gift that I've been able to experience life to this point, you know, and even the the process of dying, I think is even beautiful because that's a state of surrender that we will only ever experience one time. At least for humans, for the state of humans.

SPEAKER_02 24:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:00

But I hear like even in that, your your brain produces like this psychedelic something.

SPEAKER_04 25:07

It's a DMT. So we we we naturally the body and the brain naturally produce DMT uh throughout our life, but there's a huge onset when we're born. So when we're passing through the the the birth canal, there's a huge onset of DMT, and it stays pretty strong in the body for the first several years of life. And then there is a huge onset of and release of DMT uh when we pass. And so scientists have been able to tell that. So uh that is you can also ingest or smoke DMT. I just actually finished a book from a doctor that that he was the first and only approved doctor to do clinical studies through the government approved with IV injected. So basically it'd start an IV in the arm and then and then inject uh a certain level of DMT, and he recorded all of the sessions and pretty phenomenal, pretty phenomenal drug. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 25:59

That's so cool.

SPEAKER_04 26:00

So yeah, we do get a lot of it when we die. And some people would say, well, maybe that's just another birth, and maybe that's walking into the next chapter.

SPEAKER_03 26:09

That is walking into the next chapter, yeah. So even then, it's something to look forward to, right? So here we are.

SPEAKER_04 26:17

Here we are.

SPEAKER_03 26:19

2026. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 26:24

Gosh, it's halfway, it's almost halfway through 2026. This year is time speeding up. It's it's starting to uh go faster and faster. And I'm like, wait, slow down for a give me a weekend.

SPEAKER_03 26:37

Um come back. Okay, but I am curious because I know you know you mentioned writing your you have three books, and I know you have the sword method. And so I'm curious what was your intention with bringing the sword method? Like what what was what what did you feel? Because I know that it it really bridges a gap for men talking about time and needing to take that pause and how important that pause is. I think the sword method really establishes that kind of relationship with the pause.

SPEAKER_04 27:20

I should have had you write my uh marketing pieces for the relationship with the pause. So uh so well said. Yeah. So I I wrote the bubble theory, and it was given to me in a meditation of kind of how all this came together, and and that's sort of my big overarching vision of relationships, communication, the whole thing. But but as I as I started to study the the how, that's sort of the why. The how was it was not real clear for guys, and there wasn't a lot of information. You know, you got John Gottman, you've got others out there that have pioneered for relationships, but but specifically for men on how to master emotions, how to how to become masculinely empathetic is kind of some of the the slang that I use in the book. And so I geared it and geared it. I I uh I wrote it kind of to mirror like a Japanese sword exercises. So katas and kumitachis, where the katas are all the internal work that we have to do ourselves to understand it. And the kumitachis are sort of the conflict that you do with sparring with swords, and and so it is it is written for men. It's written because there wasn't a field manual to show guys what do you do when conflict shows up. I didn't have a field manual. And man, if I had had a manual that said, here's a five-step program that you can do in five plus seconds to get control of yourself when you're starting to get tunnel vision and when emotions come up and when you want to react and defend. I mean, man, I could be so much further along than I am at 45. But that's why I wrote it. I wrote it to hopefully provide a roadmap for for guys that that say, you know what, I don't like maybe the best way that I handle conflict, and I don't really have a tool because there's books that have been written on it, but but there's not a training manual. And this is sort of supposed to be like a training manual because in in the martial arts world and the fighting world, when I was doing that a lot, right, you you fall to your level of training when a crisis comes up. A lot of brothers that I've worked with, they oh, I'm just gonna flip the switch, I'm gonna see red, I'm gonna punch the guy and all this stuff, and now I'm gonna defend my family. And you're like, no, no, what actually happens when when shit hits the fan is that you fall to the level of training. And the same exact thing happens when you get into emotional conflict, is you fall to the level of training. And if you're not practicing and you're not rewiring your nervous system basically to keep from flaring up, you're not gonna be able to control it. That's why that's why I wrote the sword method. And so it's it's it's it's an easy-ish read, but it's really meant to be digested and executed with with you know 16, 17 different katas that you need to practice. Like if you truly want to become an empathetic man and under and centered, this is this is the way, uh, this is a way. Doesn't it's not the only way, of course, but this is a way that that that I I felt called to put into the world.

SPEAKER_03 30:22

That's good. Yeah, I think it falls in line too with like emotional intelligence and maybe even great for for fatherhood, right? Because just like you said, had I had this sooner. And I think that's important because it still falls in line too, relationship to self. And we're all we're all adapting and evolving, and we we have a lot of lines of of trauma, right, that we're working through as well. And I think when we look at men, they have that motherhood wound. And honestly, the fatherhood wound where it was if you were a boy in the home, you were to be tough, you weren't allowed to have emotions, you had to help raise the family in a sense, right? We have a lot of men in this era that started going to work at you know, 14 years old and things of that nature to want to help support their mother. So like when we go back to age, let's say, I don't know, 20, 30, even 40 years ago, you know, we we do see a lot of a lot of trauma and a lot of life lived with the way they only knew how. So I think this this is important. And so where does it start? It it it starts with our our new generation, where that we can start molding them with these tools that they will use for the rest of their life. Cause life be life it. It's always gonna life. You're you're always gonna have conflict. It doesn't matter. We're just we're we're human. So yeah, I think I think this is just an invitation, I suppose, for for the the younger men, the fathers that are kind of reaching more than just the parenting book, because it still stems to relationship to yourself and how you're molding yeah, our future boys.

SPEAKER_04 32:22

Yeah. I think there's something to be said for like the baby boomer generation and and they did master a part of masculine energy, which was the provider. They fought in several wars. They they showed up when duty called and said, I will freaking throw it on my back and and do it, right? And so they they understood a form of masculine energy. And and when they came home, the ones that didn't have PTSD or the ones that were serving here in the in the in the in the homeland, right? They used the tools that they had at the time, which was stoicism. And and I'm I'm a I I get a lot of pushback from a lot of guys because I I don't like the stoic. Stoicism is is putting a facade on and basically saying nothing you say or do can hurt me, and I I will stand there and absorb it. And that's not, in my opinion, healthy. And so that generation used the tools that they had. And so I think you're right. There, there's an opportunity, even for that generation, although a lot of them have said, nope, it's worked for this long, we're not changing. It's like, okay, I totally respect that. But even in take the take the 33 guys that were in in Arkansas two weeks ago with me. One one of them in my group specifically was he was 67 years old. And he he just said, I I he's come a long ways, but he's like, I I want I want to finish the next 30 years super strong. And that that takes a lot of courage, that takes a lot of humility to show up with you know a bunch of 20 and 30-year-old men. I'm putting myself in the 30-year-old category, right? Uh and be like, I there's more I can there's more I can uh work on because I'm not completely happy with how I've been through those years. So but you're right. I the the probably the best way to get uh return of investment right on a on a on the effort is for the next generation coming up and saying, hey, there are better tools. And we live in in this round of this cycle, whatever you want to call it, right? The the most information available to us that we've ever had in our entire existence. And so and it's only gonna get better and better and better with with availability. So yeah, teaching and exposing and showing the next generation that there are methods out there, there are tools. It doesn't have to be this way just because your dad or grandpa or great-grandpa did it, right? We we can we can cut those chains and we can say, no, we're gonna we're gonna start again and we're gonna create our legacy going forward.

SPEAKER_03 34:57

Yeah. That way you're not in the 30s and 40s wishing, just wishing. And I I know what that feels like because there was a point in time in my life where I was like, I could have skipped over the bullshit. Now, I know for me that was that was my purpose. My purpose was to experience the life that I I have experienced so that I can end it, right? So I can end that generational brokenness. But also it's like, okay, so what was missing? What was the missing piece? Where had I had this or had I known about this, what would have prevented me from taking those paths? And so in every conversation, and I think that's why this season is really important to me, it all stemmed back to the relationship to self that the individual had. And it lacked. It lacked on various levels because one, they were either searching outside of themselves, two, they were in an identity crisis, just trying to hang on to something that made them feel seen, valued, heard, or like for me, right? Reaching for the bottle, going out and getting drunk, because that version of me could be seen, I thought could be accepted. Sober me, I I was, I had, I didn't have safety in my body. I didn't have confidence to be out in the open that way. But I wanted to connect with people, right? So yeah, I think I think when I look at the broader picture and how can we skip over the bullshit? How can we you still have to have your experiences, right? But how can we limit those experiences so that you're trusting yourself and so that you have self-belief? And I I still think that's relationship to self. And those tools, I think that you have in your three books that you've written, they carry a lot of depth and wisdom and and emotional integrity that like someone could hang on to that, you know, and use that for a life skill. I mean, it's not tangible in the way of a sword or weapon or whatever. But I do think it's deeply rooted in someone that's wanting to take that next step for themselves. So I think that's so cool that that you you knew that there was a missing piece and you created the bridge.

SPEAKER_04 37:43

Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I and I think to highlight on that that conversation with do we have to go through it so that we learn it? Versus can we be shown and fast track that growth? It it you know, I believe that that we will get to a point where we don't have to go through it. And the next generations and the next generations, and in my kiddos' generations if we step up now and start in teaching them, we have imagine how much we can condense that that that time because they're not going to be having to go through the the the healing of the trauma of the abusive parents and of the neglect and of all the things that oh I didn't learn how to to regulate and and learn who I am, right? It just condenses the timelines of of of the universe. And so it's a big it's a big topic, and we're we're kind of just skirting around the outskirts uh outside of it right now, but I really appreciate you bringing it up because I was shown in a in a meditation, uh part of my vision is right to help help bring peace to the world. And I was shown at the end of one of these meditations that the biggest key part of that is it's not my job to necessarily teach the next generation, but the next generation is responsible for, and there's others that will come along that it is their job, maybe it's your job, maybe it's somebody else's, that that's their vision and their purpose, right? My that's not my purpose, but the next generation is who and how that piece gets kept on Earth. Because what's happened in the past is when that piece has entered a home, a community, a country, the world, you know, depending on your belief of how long we've been around in this galaxy here floating, right? There's uh there's it's happened, but the piece hasn't held because the next generation was sort of neglected to continue that. And so that was part of the matrix that was shown to me. It was like, oh my gosh, it's not just this piece, which is what I focus on of getting to the to the piece, piece to get into the piece, see the two different spellings. Don't you love English? Uh it's it's the next, it's training the next generation and aligning with the the energy workers and the light workers and the teachers and the and the people that are gonna kind of help build that next second, third, fourth, fifth generation down of these tools.

SPEAKER_03 40:07

So yeah, I yeah, I totally I totally agree with that.

SPEAKER_04 40:13

Yeah, so there. That's uh that's why I wrote the sword method. Here's a book, hey. So I yeah, that was fun. And then yeah, the bubble theory. I wrote these three books, and the my first book I wrote was about emotional intelligence for men, and it it was I didn't know what I was doing. I was trying to just put everything together and like learn how to write and get stuff published, and and that thing outsells 10 to 1 all my other books right now. And it's so funny because I'm like, no, no, no, read, read the good books. Don't don't don't read that book. And and it's just people are gobbling it up on on Amazon and and uh I it just cracks me up because I'm going, ah, I wish I need to I need to put a second edition out because that was that was amazing. It's like my testing, but yeah.

SPEAKER_03 40:58

Well, I think that's interesting because I think that's that's showing you where the level of people that are able to receive, like what is their capacity to be able to receive, right? Yeah, and so that's probably where they're at in their life that they're able to, you know, not be activated or want to reject it, right? Yeah, so I know for you, you think, oh, these other ones are so good, but it's because you've you've lived it, you've been there, and you know, like, oh, you're just gonna advance to the next level, bro. Like you're going, you're going to beat the bad guy. Like, well, what what am I thinking of? Who is the big dinosaur guy from Mario Brothers?

SPEAKER_04 41:42

Oh, yeah, he was in the in the two movies. Yeah, I don't know. I I I watched him, but I wasn't a huge Mario. Yeah, the dino guy, dino kid.

SPEAKER_03 41:51

Yeah, that's what I keep picturing. Like you go to the next level and you have to beat the dinosaur in the castle, you know. But but you had it really become really experienced before you got to the next level to beat the next level of dinosaur or dragon, or I don't know what he is. Yeah, and so that's kind of like what I received with your book. How um how you can level it out that way. I think it's perfect.

SPEAKER_04 42:18

That's beautifully said. I'll take it. It works.

SPEAKER_03 42:23

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 42:24

What are you working on? What I know, but yeah, I I'd love to hear more on what you have in the hopper for long-term. How do you how are you rolling this out? How are you helping the next generation?

SPEAKER_03 42:37

So I have a few avenues working. I'm really getting my foot wet into the the public school system. So that's where children spend the majority of their lives, right? It's about a thousand hours a year, is what they're spending in there. And so I know that there's deep reflection in saying, well, it starts in the home, and we're not here to raise your child and all of those things. But when you look at the broadness of how much time children spend in school, they're actually spending more time in school than they are with their family. And they're being influenced by many other children and many other teachers, right? So we can't change that part of it. But what we can change is just like children can learn skills on how to memorize or learning mathematical skills or how to read, or you can also teach them those human skills, those human tools to where when they are going home, home that may be broken, home that may be surviving, home that may be reactive, they have tools that they can use for themselves in protecting themselves or in staying grounded or in um regulating, right? So that's essentially where I'm starting because I feel that is our future generation. And I'm positioning it more nervous system health because I feel that it has such a a deep foundation in the science realm to where it could be received in. A government funded place. And I have Sur Life Productions. So essentially, Sur Life Productions is a broadcast that just shifts the lens, shifts perspective. So we all have the same view, but our perspective is very much different. And we have a lot of information out there that we get to take in and decide what we want to believe or how we want to live by. And so Sorreal Life Productions is just bringing the contrast to living to life so that there is a broadcast out there that can be received. But yeah, just really getting the understanding of what it means to be human. And I think that's even a part that we don't learn in school. We learn biology, we learn chemistry. And we learn all about our body that the we have a brain, we have a heart, we have bones, we know all the vertebrae in our back, right? But we're not learning what it means to be human. Like, did you ever learn in school that you are a creature of energy? Probably not. And I don't think they are now. And so and what does it mean to be energy, right? So, like, what can velocity be received in in a human way? Absolutely. And I think that's where like momentum and expansion and being in direct relationship with the energy of your life.

SPEAKER_04 45:56

And we've learned a little bit about the mental side where we we math and history, and we gotta remember those things. And they try a little bit to do the emotional side, like don't bully, and you know, we don't punch. That's not nice because that's hurt somebody's feelings. But what you're talking about is like the quantum, the the well the new side that the biological, like yeah, yeah, I think well, and so we're we're creatures of of energy, right?

SPEAKER_03 46:34

Which means we're constantly moving. So like when you put into reference of emotions and how emotions are energy in motion, and you s shove it and you block it and you stuff it. Now think about a an electrical line. Imagine if it just got like blocked, what what would happen? It would freaking explode. It would have nowhere to freaking go. It would accumulate, it would like pressure, like you know what I mean.

SPEAKER_04 47:12

Oh, you could charge your phone well, yeah, and that's another thing.

SPEAKER_03 47:16

Like we need to be charged, right? How do we how do we become charged? But yeah, I mean you you you could go the resistance, you could sure you could you could go on and on and on. But uh so okay, so I'm curious because maybe I don't even know what is a narcissist.

SPEAKER_04 47:35

Well, it's less than three percent of actual people that get diagnosed with with the narcissistic label. And it's essentially there it's a person that doesn't feel that they have ever done anything wrong, and that every that they're they are they're the center of conversation, they're the only person that matters. It doesn't really matter what your feelings are because I'm actually more important than you, and I'm I'm I should be treated as that, and therefore it's okay if I insult and belittle and put you down or or use other things like gaslighting or projection and stuff because I am a wonderful human that is God's gift to mankind. And so it's such a very small sliver of people that truly are narcissists, but we as a society have slipped into this, oh, because they had a tendency to have a narcissistic thing come up that we label them as narcissists. And that and that's not fair, it's just clinically not fair, it's just clinically not right. But it it's funny because you uh it's sounding like most females are labeling men narcissists, and most men are labeling females narcissists, and you're like, okay. But it's sort of there's there's things that like projecting is is a big one where where I deal a lot with people that that are using projection. And so projection is is is something where you oh, you're out cheating because your phone rang, right? And and it's something that they're actually the one cheating in the relationship, but they're projecting their behaviors onto the other person, and so that falls into a narcissistic pattern as well, which it can be. Gaslighting is is another large example on the on the clinical side where you you literally knock the plant over, and this is a crazy example, and then the the person saw you do it, and they're like, Why'd you knock the plant over? I didn't knock the plant over. It fell over from the wind, it fell over from the wind. Uh the wind blew through the window and knocked it. And they're like, I saw you, or but that's like an extreme, right? But in most situations, you tell someone, you know, why you be you call someone a name and they're like, Why'd you call me that name? I didn't call you that name. And you're like, Whoa, I you literally just called me that name, and now you're telling me that you didn't. And so it came from the movie back in the Alfred Hitchcock, I think it was in the 50s when they created the movie called Gaslighting, where he was trying to drive his wife insane. And so he would like light candles and do all this crazy, move things around the house. There's an old black and white film, and that's where the term came from. And so people use gaslighting in relationships not as often as people actually think they are, and so they they label it, oh, you're gaslighting mean. You're like, no, they're probably just being manipulative, and so manipulation is is is another thing that falls into narcissistic, right? But there's also a cluster of personality disorders like borderline personality disorder, it's a BPD. That is that falls sometimes under the narcissistic umbrella. And so there's all these different vignettes that when you truly look at it, you're going, no, that person's not a narcissist. But they used or they they they have some tendencies. And so that's why I always try to get people to be like, well, okay, it's a very small percentage, and most of the 3% in the world is probably in our American government, in the ruling elite, and those are the true narcissists that that are out there. We have tendencies, and the the key is when we realize that we have a tendency, or if someone points it out, we say, Okay, let's how do how do I fix that? How do I how do I get over that? And how do I how do I correct that? Because you didn't fall in love with a narcissist, you fell in love with a man that changed down the road and and he slid into some of these tendencies, but but a narcissist will always be a narcissist, and and now they can cover it for eight to twelve weeks at the beginning of a relationship, what we call like the mask wearing phase, where the narcissist you know may love bomb or do all these things to to show you, but love bombing doesn't mean that you're a narcissist, it just means that that's a tactic that they have used, and it again it falls on the spectrum. So I uh having uh extensive coaching history and all of this, it's like ah, okay, let's go easy on the terms, let's go easy on the labels, right? Because that that that's not fair. However, there are tendencies and there's a whole bunch of them out there that people use. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03 51:55

No, I love that because I'm like so disconnected from labels and terms that it's like, well, so what does that mean to you though?

SPEAKER_04 52:05

Yeah. You know, I I've I've gotten in the habit of you can tell very quickly when you sit down with someone and saying, Hey, why, why, why did you break up? And you can instantly pick it up and they say, Oh, well, she had an art, she was an arc, and she just gaslit me, and she did this, and that this and she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she, she. And you're like, okay, this person's probably not in a stage to actually start working on themselves, as opposed to, you know, uh, it was a really difficult relationship. There was some uh infidelity that occurred, they we decided to part ways, and I've learned that my boundaries weren't very strong, and I realized that I needed to stand up for myself more, and I needed to do this because I just I just allowed this to happen. And it's it's the the ownership phase. And so you're right, you can tell very quickly are they using the you you you or are they saying, you know? Yeah, I I I kind of I kind of dropped the ball there and I I I let someone in my life that I I knew was probably not a good fit for me, and I didn't stand up for what I believed, and and I didn't hold firm because I was afraid to death of losing that love. And I think that's that's something that that I personally walked through, right? Was I was I was afraid in my relationship journey with with the females, right? It was I was afraid of losing love and and dying alone for so many years of my life that I would hold on to something that my body and my gut said, nah, that's that's not healthy, that's not good. And I was just scared. I was just scared of it.

SPEAKER_03 53:36

So yeah. Yeah, well, and I think that's that's so good. That's such a great point of reference. And how many of us are pushing past that level uh honestly, our body's communicating with us, like, hey, hey, dude, listen, this is not a good idea, or just all the signals because our body knows, and we sit there and we force something to work. And then this can go in any relationship. I can, I mean, I did this in friendship for so freaking long because I was so afraid to lose the tenure of my friendship, you know, and it was like, but what value did it have besides the tenure? It it didn't hold any value at all, and I was still left so unsatisfied, so unsatisfied. And in those moments, it was just like, oh, well, I don't know, I would justify it. I would justify it any which way. And I think also we hang on to the potential. We see potential in people and we hang on to that, and so we're willing to ignore our body signals.

SPEAKER_04 54:52

So are we actually hanging on to potential or are we scared if we let go of that that we may lose something that we truly love?

SPEAKER_03 55:03

Yeah, well, I mean, for me, there are many friendships where I hung on to the potential because I could see their who they could be. Like I could see their their potential. I don't know, it's like very interesting how I I could see people, even though they were people that would take, take, take, only call me when they needed something, right? And I was like, oh, okay, yeah, I'm gonna help you because I know that you you just if if I was in this situation, I would want someone to do this for me.

SPEAKER_04 55:46

Yeah, I got some stories on that front. Those are good lessons to learn, right? Yeah. My buddy, uh I went through a divorce and my last divorce, and uh who I thought was my buddy and his wife kind of sided with me through the divorce, and and uh we became friends, and and I was I thought it was a great friendship, and it was like six, five, six years of of this, and I would go to his house and I would work on his floor, I remodeled his his basement forum, all this stuff that I would like just do, do, do, do, do, do, do, give, and give and give. And then there wasn't there wasn't a a single thing. Be like one time I was like, hey, I need help moving. Oh, I'm busy. And I was like, oh. And it ends up that that that friends that I gave all that energy to, which I thought was just this, this is what friends do. We just show up. We don't, we don't ask questions, we just give. We're selfless, right? That that's that's what it is. And that was what unfolded, and you're like, this is not what a friend is, and so that helps me understand how do I speak my needs and my boundaries, even in friendships. It's like, hey, this is what I I I want this out of a friend. Like, yeah, it needs to be a a reciprocal process. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_03 57:03

Yeah, I call that inner authority, right? So that's so interesting because my boundary forever and ever now, while I am ever alive, is I will never go against my intuition. Yeah, because that falls in line with anything. I have a direct relationship with my body, with with my center, with who I am, that I know the signal, I know the difference. And when that comes up, it doesn't matter where I'm at or what I'm doing, I'm never gonna go against it.

SPEAKER_02 57:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 57:36

And I think how did you get to trusting that though? That's that's the thing that that's uh well most people aren't taught, right?

SPEAKER_03 57:45

They're not taught that because they don't have a point of reference. Because their point of reference is my body feels this way. Why does it feel this way? And then you're usually told, oh, you just have anxiety, oh you're just scared, you need to push past your fear. You know, you're just afraid of the unknown. And so if those are your points of reference, then you're never gonna learn what that even means for your body. So for me, it was the constant not listening to my intuition. Every time I got that feeling, that signal, I would push past it. And that's when I would end up in a spiral. I would end up in in failure. I would, I would end up in yeah, in in this in the spiral.

SPEAKER_01 58:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 58:41

So you know, even now with my kids, like that is a deep tool of you know, that feeling you get, you know, sometimes it can make you feel like you're scared or your tummy just doesn't feel right, and they all know what I'm talking about. And you know, they'll tell me, they'll be like, mommy, I have this weird feeling. I have this weird feeling that something's gonna happen, you know, and we don't dismiss it. We we we pause, okay. Well, what does it mean? And this is where they're learning because maybe it is fear, maybe it's excitement, maybe it's just because you know, they're afraid of the dark. Like, but they have to, we have to teach them how to create that relationship and pause and be like, oh, this isn't real. Okay, I'm good. Or, oh, this isn't mine. I'm I'm afraid for someone else.

SPEAKER_04 59:34

Yeah. I think that's exactly right. Is that when we learn, that would be the stages that I help teach, right? Is that first we have to learn to recognize that that there's something there. And then we start to learn how to decipher the actual frequencies that are coming in. And and it's a beautiful way that you stated it, right? Because sometimes those frequencies can be, you know, it could be fear, anxiety, worry, excitement, or it could be somebody else's, or it could be, you know, there's there's research out there that has shown that like vibrations come from three sources, right? They come from ourselves, they come from another person, and then they kind of come from the collective ether that's out there, which you know, whatever you want to think, angels, demons, god, the devil, whatever, all the collective unconsciousness that's that's out there from Carl Jung, that's that's like the third way that we can get get vibrations through thought or feelings. And so, yeah, teaching them at a young age how to recognize it first to stop and listen, and then eventually you'll get to a point where you can, you can, they or they can understand what what is that vibration that's coming in. Because every vibration has a signature.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:44

It sure does. Yeah, and that's being in relationship with the universe. I think that is probably the best experience I have ever experienced. I mean, outside of giving birth, is being in direct relationship with the universe. And when they say that the universe meets you halfway, it's so fucking true. It is like a phenomenon, but it's real life, and that's how life is effortless. Not that I'm not still doing or working or creating, I am, but I I have I am in emotion and in direct relationship because I can follow, I can follow the raid directions. I'm not chasing outside of myself. Now I'm not perfect at all by any means. I'm not saying like this is the only way to live. But what I'm this is just my experience because I've lived the contrast. I've I've been on the hamster wheel. You know, I've hit rock bottom so many fucking times of like, if this is what life is, then I don't want anything to do with it. Where I was driving on the opposite, opposite way of the highway because I wanted to end my fucking life because I didn't want to be a part of it anymore, because I was doing all the things, all the things that they were telling me to do. Push past your fear, hustle, hustle, hustle, work smarter, not harder, like all the things. And I still failed. So now that I am in direct reciprocity with the universe and and how it flows and the self-belief and the inner authority that we have in relationship to self, I swear, is key to you know, just opening so much opportunity.

SPEAKER_04 1:02:44

Love it. Thanks for sharing. That's beautiful. That's what that's what we want to hear. It's like, ah, oh, I can feel it. It's good. See, that that vibration from you was one of one of purpose and definiteness of purpose. That's like this is what I know with every ounce of my fiber in. It just permeates. I love it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 1:03:17

Thank you. No, I do know it.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:19

When your heart is raised to race and let's keep alive. And you feel like you can love to tell the sun comes in the house.